Hi,

I just accepted an offer for my first professional LIS position so have just been through the process. Although I am not working in the academic environment I would recommend that when they call to offer you the position ask for any necessary information like offer letter, benefits in writing so that you can look things over. Never accept the job right when they call! Always give yourself time to think and discuss. This is what I did and after looking over information I asked various questions about the benefits and some other specifics.

If you decide to negotiate for a higher salary I would wait till you have everything in writing, think a day or so, and then contact them either on the phone or via written reply as to why your skills/experience/market rate would call for a higher salary. If they offer a higher salary I would think it perfectly reasonable to think over that as well for a few days.

A few things to keep in mind (advice I heard from an HR person at a big library, among others):

When they call to offer you the job, they'll also tell you the salary and moving expenses they'll give you. When they offer you the job is the ONLY time you have any power to negotiate. NEVER accept the first offer right away. And never say yes during that phone call, no matter how excited you are and how much you want the job. They've put a lot of time into finding someone, and they won't withdraw the offer just because you need a couple of days.

Kindly thank them and let them know you need to think it over and you'll get back to them in a few days. A week is reasonable. Anything more, unless you have a specific reason to ask for it, seems like asking a lot. But always ask for some time.

Next, remember that this salary will impact all your future earnings and your retirement. Seriously. If you're a woman, remember that men usually get more because they ask for more. And remember that (especially if this is an academic library), they probably made you an offer *expecting* you to ask for more.

Then call your most assertive friend, your career-oriented relative, your LIS prof, your feminist friend, whomever, to talk to them and help motivate you to ask for more money.

And remember that things are often negotiable even if you've been told they are not. I was told by one university HR person, during my on-campus interview, that the library never paid moving expenses. When the director later called to offer me the job, they offered me a certain salary and no moving expenses... when I called back and said no (a sincere no, not a game-playing no), they offered me a few thousand more and two thousand in moving expenses. I still said no (because at that point I had another job offer which I was going to accept; the money wasn't the only issue), but was so irritated to learn that, basically, they had lied to me.

I suspect there are many entry level librarians, especially women, who pay moving expenses and don't ask for enough because we're not advocating for ourselves.

Then, ask for more. :)

Remember that the director or HR person does this all the time. They won't think anything bad about your for asking for more. You'll let them off easy if you don't. One note: don't say, "I can't accept the job for less than $$" unless you mean it! Because there's a chance they really can't give you that. There are ways to have a pleasant conversation that is also a negotiation.

On another note: I'd also not expect a written offer til after you've negotiated, unless the original offer comes in writing. I would expect a phone call from the HR person or library director offering you the job at a certain salary. You call them back, negotiate, agree to something, and then you get the written contract.

Thank you all.

I am female, and I am certainly aware that women are often paid less because we fail to ask for more. I don't want to make that mistake.

I am able to find salary information for the organization I'd be working at, but it is fairly out of date. So, I'm trying to update those numbers by adjusting them assuming a standard pay increase rate per year. I'm hoping that this technique has given me a pretty good idea of the pay range for librarians at this institution.

I've heard that it's standard to ask for 10% more than their starting offer. Is that a good rule of thumb?

I really appreciate your help.

I've been a librarian for almost 20 years. In that time I have never seen any institution offer to negotiate with me over salary. You get a job offer, a salary figure, and are told "Take it or leave it. We have a hundred other people who will be happy to take this job."
I think this idea that the fact you are being offered a job somehow gives you power is somewhat false. Institutions see the applicant as the one with a problem e.g. they need a job -- since, if the position isn't filled, the institution can just shove the job responsibilities for the open position on someone already there and take years (or never) to fill the position.
I've actually had institutions lie me to me about what they will do simply to get me on board. And, later, when you ask, what about that they act like they've never heard of you.

Schools are also vastly uneven in what they will give to candidates. I once moved 2000 miles for a job. I got $500 in moving expenses. The next person hired, who moved 200 miles, got $3500.
There's really no rhyme or reason to why schools do what they do. It's whatever the particular director feels like doing on a particular day.
My point: Get everything in writing. If a job offer or a promise of moving expenses or a commitment to doing a spousal hire isn't in writing it doesn't exist. And if the school refuses to give you its promises in writing -- RUN!! RUN AWAY!! VERY VERY FAST!!! University and library administrators will lie about anything and everything to get what they want. Some assumption that they are interested in your development or your success or your happiness is wrong. They simply want to get as much work out of you for the smallest amount of money they can pay -- and when they feel that isn't happening they will discard you like a piece of garbage.

Maybe it is harsh... but...when you work an 80 hour week where you are 1)giving advice to management which they take and use as their own ideas 2)have to constantly cover for people who just decide that they don't want to work today 3)have to take abuse because, gee, you don't feel that you can support the librarian with two years experience and no publications who feels they deserve immediate early tenure AND promotion to full professor 4)have the same librarian tell you that "Sorry. Your four books and 15 peer reviewed articles are just not enough, in her view, for you to be promoted, and, by the way, you should start sucking up if you expect to be reappointed." and 5) despite constantly having to run your department in your bosses absence for weeks on end you are consistently told by other libraries "We love you, but, gee, you don't really have any formal management experience do you?? Sorry. No sale."

Maybe I have a reason to be harsh, LibraryBob?? You think???

I'm too early in my career to be as cynical as goodlibrarian... but I've always gotten more when I asked for it.

I wish people wouldn't say I'm cynical. I'm not. I simply have seen what I've seen. And, moreover, I have another 40 years of this to look forward to. Endless days of meaninglessness where, regardless of my level of achievement or accomplishment, I see the fruits of that labor go to others who have neither earned it nor deserve it, but insist that they are entitled to it.

I deserved better from my profession. Don't call it cynicism. Call it disappointment. For practical purposes I'm doing a life sentence in prison -- the only difference is that I get to leave at night and go home.

I think you have just had a run of bad experiences. I have worked for many organizations (academic, corporate, etc.) in many different roles (custodian, educator, librarian, manager, etc.) and every organization could not just wait for the next person to come along. The candidate we wanted and offered the position did have the ball in their court. We wanted them.

If you have had problems in the past, than make sure you get things in writing.

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Brian C. Gray
Head of Reference & Engineering Librarian
Kelvin Smith Library
Case Western Reserve University
http://blog.case.edu/bcg8
bcg8@case.edu

Are you looking at other options since you are so unhappy with this situation?

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Brian C. Gray
Head of Reference & Engineering Librarian
Kelvin Smith Library
Case Western Reserve University
http://blog.case.edu/bcg8
bcg8@case.edu